By Paul Freeman [1993 Interview]

With intensity and versatility, Holly Hunter has carved out a dazzling body of work, encompassing film, television and theatre. She made indelible impressions in a wide range of roles, including those in "Raising Arizona," "Broadcast News," "The Positively True Adventures of the Alleged Texas Cheerleader-Murdering Mom," "O Brother Where Art Thou?" and "The Big Sick." Hunter, a Georgia native, has lent her talents to animation ("The Incredibles"), comic book epics ("Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice") and a hit TV series ("Saving Grace").

We interviewed Hunter upon the release of 1993's "The Piano." The film, written and directed by Jane Campion, co-stars Hunter, Sam Neill, Harvey Keitel and Anna Paquin. It revolves around Ada, a mute woman who travels to New Zealand in the 1850s with her young daughter and a cherished piano. The woman has been lured by an arranged marriage to a wealthy plantation owner. But her heated attraction to a worker complicates matters. For her work in the film, Hunter earned an Academy Award as Best Actress.

POP CULTURE CLASSICS:
Did you learn new lessons about the craft and undiscovered areas of your ability, when you had to perform without using your voice?

HOLLY HUNTER:
Well, I think when I had the opportunity to perform a character who is as uncompromised as this one is and as complicated, it calls on me to use some things that I may not know about, that I may not know about myself. So often actors and actresses, particularly actresses, don't get too many chances to utilize their skills and approach acting as a craft, because really, all you're asked to do is to stay close to home, stay close to what is close to you, as a human being, day to day.

And I think what excites and entices me most as an actress, with opportunities like "The Piano" and like the HBO movie that I did with Michael Ritchie ["The Positively True Adventures of the Alleged Texas Cheerleader-Murdering Mom," for which Hunter won a Best Actress Emmy award] is that it calls for a departure, to use a different persona or a different whole palette of personas, other than the one that I wear out in my every day life. So that's an exciting challenge.

PCC:
The form of sign language used was basically invented for the film?

HUNTER:
Yes. I really just wanted to create a sign language that first off looked authentic and didn't look like a skill that was learned for a movie. And secondly, I wanted the sign language to be quite beautiful and for the signs themselves for each word that we made up and the vocabulary, that it made for a very graceful, beautiful look, because Ada had to have an awful lot of femininity and elegance that she brings into this other world with her that stays intact, no matter what circumstances arise. And I thought that the sign language would be a great vehicle to express a lot of that elegance and that innate grace.

PCC:
How do you think your character, Ada, her morality and sense of identity, conflicted with the sensibilities of her time?

HUNTER:
This is a woman who identifies her needs and then tries to take care of them. I actually think that, at that time, not only did women not follow their own needs, I don't think they recognized that they had any. I think that there was a real blur between where they ended and where their families and their men began.

To distinguish yourself as an individual with needs that did not necessarily mirror your husband's or your children's was something that was not even known about. It was not cognizant in somebody's psyche, that they were a lone, one single entity and that there are things to be listened to, within your own entity. And that's a modern sensibility now, because women do think about that. And it's, I think, difficult even in our social structure for a woman to, without punishment or without criticism, explore and fulfill her desires.

PCC:
And Ada exists in a world where sex is not treated as casually as it is now.

HUNTER:
Yeah, I think one of the great hinges of this story is that what you have is a director's modern knowledge of sex. And that we are kind of barraged with it in today's world, so it becomes kind of diluted to us, through magazines and television. It's everywhere. It's all acceptable to talk about. Nothing is really new about it... except the experience itself, which is probably new to each of us individually at one time or another in our lives.

Normally that's probably like a teenage discovery, something that you discover early on in life, this urge, this exciting thing. But what you've got in this movie are three adults who have baggage. They have reference points from their entire lives. They have responsibilities. They have full lives with baggage and scars and loss behind them. And that's what they're bringing to this new arena.

PCC:
Do you think in a period piece, it's sometimes easier to delve into issues and relationships that might be difficult for contemporary audiences to deal with?

HUNTER:
I think that there's a certain kind of retrospective you can have on a period piece. Even if it's 10 years ago, you have an overview of it that you don't have while you're in it. And I think that Jane utilized that really well to explore some modern issues under the auspices of another time period. And that was a great arena for all of us to work in, too.

PCC:
What do you think are the elements of the piece that will strike a responsive chord?

HUNTER:
You have three adults portrayed in this movie who have adult agendas. They have various life experiences collectively. They have responsibilities as adults. They've all traveled a great deal as adults, because they've gone from one continent to another and, in that time, traveling those distances was really tough. It would take three months, by boat, to get from Europe to New Zealand. And these people discover, as adults, sex, the passion of sex, the power of sex... and love, for the first time possibly in their lives.

Now granted, my character has had a child, an illegitimate child. So she has had some experience, but it was probably young experience and probably didn't delve into any great depths emotionally for her... although a child came out of it. That's unique, because we as adults, living in the 20th century, normally experience some sexual awakening some introduction to sex and love, maybe as teenagers, when you don't have all the baggage and you don't have the repercussions of your actions to deal with. And these people, they have their whole lives set up and to pursue a passion has some consequences. They have to pay for it. And maybe the repercussions are quite damaging. And they have to deal with that and they have to live with the consequences for the rest of their lives. So that is also something, I think, that is different in this movie. It has a keener edge than if the movie had just been a thoroughly modern one.

PCC:
Do you think the consequences of repressed passion take on a special light in the AIDS era, another sort of relevance?

HUNTER:
Possibly. I haven't really thought about that. But that's probably one of the resonances that the movie could unexpectedly have, because it is being seen in this time in our lives. And that's a ramification that we face today, of pursuing and following through with a passion, is that it could mean fatality.

And I think that you get this feeling in the movie that darkness and the possibility of something death-like could occur at any time. The possibility is there always, just on the fringe of the story, which I think gives it a kind of foreboding quality and also kind of a tantalizing quality, too, because it's something that people do flirt with -- they do flirt with destruction, with self destruction or... passion takes all kinds of twists and turns in even normal human beings, who don't necessarily answer all the calls. But we're all capable of great cruelty. And we're all capable of being out of control, if love doesn't deal us a fair hand. And these people are under that tremendous power of love, through the course of this movie.

PCC:
There is this danger surrounding the characters, because of the way they let the passion control them, rather than the other way around. Have you ever had a problem with your passion for your art taking control?

HUNTER:
No, but I mean, I think we've all experienced some follow-through of a passion in one way or another in our lives. And I think that's a reference point. It's a point of recognition for the people who respond to this movie. I think that they recognize a passionate desire at some point or another in their lives, whether they follow through with it or not. Maybe they wanted to... or maybe they actually did. I'm not saying that this movie is propaganda for not following through with your passions, because the characters do receive an awful lot of good from it. A lot of good comes out of it. But not without cost.

PCC:
A lot of actors talk about the craft and equate it with music, referring to their bodies as instruments. Do you relate to that concept?

HUNTER:
Yeah, I always think that's really interesting for me. I think that always is stimulating for me to think of a scene in terms of the musicality of it and the rhythm of it. And so much of the time I glean so much information about my own character from how the rhythm of a scene naturally goes. And I want to stay true to that, to the writing, how the writing dictates what rhythm is going to be honest to it, what rhythm is most going to respect the writing.

So that's always what I've done with dialogue, is kind of think of it in terms of rhythm and music. And oftentimes, a certain dimension of my character will arise from that. Something unexpected for me will come, because I think music has an awful lot of power, if you give over to it and you respect it and play it as it should be played, then some new facets, essences will come out of it, that you would never ever anticipate or know about.

And it was the same with this movie, even though I didn't have any speech. The communication was quite rhythmic and it had its own surges and ebbs. And that was something to listen to and to find out more about Ada with.

PCC:
Was there any difference in preparation? Did you analyze your facial expressions more?

HUNTER:
No, I didn't do that. However I did go to dailies every night and just kind of calibrate the size of the character. I really wanted to make sure that I was gauging it accurately, the size of her, the economy of her. I wanted to make sure that I was being true to that, that the size of her was going to determine how much information was going to come out.

And it seems that, when someone doesn't speak, instead of shutting them out from the world, in some ways it gives the world access to them in a very, very surprising way, which I didn't know about before doing this movie. I thought she would shut the world out with her silence. And I think that was one of the reasons she chose to be silent. But in fact, I think that it opens up this whole big picture window into her, because she doesn't speak. We begin to see words as a barrier, really. It's a way of distancing people from you, instead of a way of drawing people in, because I felt that her silence was quite intimate in the end.

PCC:

PCC:
What were the most difficult aspects of the character, Ada, for you to relate to?

HUNTER:
Well, the most difficult aspect of Ada, for me, quite superficially, was playing the piano. And that's not really superficial, because I wanted to find a way that was unorthodox and personal for her to be, at the piano, and for her to play the piano. I knew that it wouldn't be appropriate or learned. It would be something that came from her, that was a very personal expression.

So the manner in which I played, I wanted to find that organically. I didn't want to force an idea and then try to copy it or impose something on myself. I just wanted to play the piano for such a period of time that I felt very, very confident with my abilities and my technical abilities at the piano. And then secondly, to start finding a way to be creative at the piano, that would be Ada. And that took some time.

And also, I'm very afraid of playing in front of people. I always played pretty lousy in front of people. So that's something that I knew I was going to have to get over pretty quickly. Because I named it -- I don't play in front of people. I just named it that for all of my life. So then I was given this opportunity and I knew that I was going to have to name it something else and be able to get over my performance anxiety.

I'm not a great technician at the piano. But I had always really loved playing, a lot. And I was totally ignorant about theory. I didn't absorb any of that stuff. But I loved to play. Always. And thought I wanted to be a concert pianist at one point, but I didn't have the stamina. I didn't have the constitution. I didn't have the chops. I didn't have the nerve. But I studied with a piano teacher for 10 years. And then I quit, because I moved to New York and I couldn't afford a piano and I didn't have the space.

So anyway, this was just an enormous opportunity for me. I consider myself a bit of a pianist now, only because Ada really put me to the test. But I did have to get over the fear of playing in front of people. Anybody who delivered anything to my house, any friend, an electrician, I would have them sit down and listen to me play, because I wanted to get used to the fact that I was going to have to do that. So I studied with a teacher, got the music, started learning the music, learned how to work with the piano in New Zealand, which was a very limited instrument, because it was so old, it was beyond its life. And then we shot all the piano pieces at the end of the shoot, which was a grace period for me. I couldn't have done it early on.

PCC:
What about the love scenes? Did you have to deal with self-consciousness with those? Or are you so immersed in the character that it wasn't a factor?

HUNTER:
That really wasn't an issue. Firstly, we trusted the script. We had such belief in the script and the way that the script opens itself up, as the story goes on. And this exploration of the erotic in these three people was something we very, very much wanted to do. So we went at the eroticism of the story unhesitatingly. We trusted Jane utterly. I think Jane has such keen instincts and she's got such a great ear for her own instincts. I just gave over to her. And Harvey was so great as Baines.

It was such an integral part of the story that we were there to tell. It came out so organically. It's something you need, as an audience member, to have the story reveal itself and unfold in that way. So there were no nudity clauses in anybody's contracts or anything like that. I just trusted Jane implicitly. I think she has incredible taste. And she's a very kind woman. And she directs with a lot of love. So from the beginning, there was a real open dialogue between Jane, Harvey and me about how we wanted to do those scenes. We talked about them a lot. We joked about them a lot. They were not precious. It was really pretty matter-of-fact. It wasn't fraught with tension or hesitation.

And we did those scenes towards the end of the shoot, when Harvey and I knew each other and Jane and I knew each other. And Jane and Harvey and I, all three, knew each other. We knew the crew. We had a lot of laughs that day. It was really fun. I can't say it was a day like any other day, because it wasn't. But it was certainly not what you might think. It was really right and good.

For me, this story is one of love and eroticism. And it's one woman's discovery of both. And I think it's a woman's acquaintanceship with the world and becoming part of the world. And what she has to sacrifice to make that crossover into participating in the world... and at the same time, keeping her aloneness. And I think she learns to have a bit of a sense of humor about herself, because I think Ada takes herself quite seriously, which I found very charming. I love her purism. I love how purist she is.

PCC:
What most impressed you about Jane, as a director?

HUNTER:
The one thing that you feel immediately from her is that she knows what she's doing. And she knows her point of view maybe better than any director I've ever worked with. She's very, very connected and intimate with her point of view. And because of that, everyone who works with her feels very, very secure, very, very safe. And she can be very, very generous, because she is so sure of herself. She has a real non-flashy confidence. And so she's very open. And you can always trust that you have a net underneath you. So you can try a whole bunch of different things, because there's somebody down there who's going to catch you.

I mean, acting is pretty much an alone kind of business. Ultimately the character is yours and you're doing it alone. And particularly with Ada, I felt very much alone, because she embraces aloneness. And I was a little afraid of that, personally. But Jane bears witness in a very beautiful way. When she bears witness, you feel slightly less alone on the journey, because she's there to see and her eyes are very clear. So it's pretty joyful, really. I really love her.

PCC:
What goes into your decisions on which roles to accept, what directions you want your career to take?

HUNTER:
Well, I have a pretty scattered approach really. I've never really had a goal, except, originally, I had two goals. One, I wanted to go to Carnegie Mellon and two, I wanted to go to New York. And really since then, I kind of stopped, as far as thinking about what I wanted to do. I really don't think much ahead. And maybe that's bad, maybe that's good, but I honestly don't.

And I also really don't have a philosophy towards approaching acting or movies. Well, I have more of a philosophy with plays. But that's about it. Hence, I think that my career is a pretty scattered one... and pretty diverse. And maybe a little hard to get a handle on. And I am really comfortable with not having a handle on it. But it might be a little uncomfortable for others.

And I take projects for a lot of different reasons. Obviously I didn't take "The Firm" for the same reason that I took "The Piano." And I didn't take "The Firm" for the same reason that I took the HBO movie about Wanda Holloway. I mean, I think that it kind of speaks for itself. As soon as I got off the plane from "The Piano," I did the HBO movie about Wanda Holloway and I left the HBO movie to do "The Firm" and I left "The Firm" to do a play in L.A. Extraordinary components made up each choice. It's a pretty big menu.

There was nothing to be said about "The Piano" that was a down side. It was a brilliant director who I longed to work with. It was a part that I wasn't sure that I could play, but I really, really wanted a shot at it. It was an extraordinary cast. It was an exotic location. I was going to get to explore some terrain as an actress that I thought would enhance my skills and my craft. And I that's something that I always want to do.

I thought it would throw me into a state of confusion, which it did. And I think, when you're in a state of chaos, it can drive you, through sheer discomfort, into new territory that maybe you didn't know that you had the chops to explore. And I think that, at this point in my career, that's something that I'm very much interested in, is being thrown in an almost disorienting way with certain projects, certain characters, to come out someplace different and hopefully have a sense of accomplishment as an actress, that I've gotten maybe a little better.

PCC:
What's lacking in the scripts you turn down?

HUNTER:
Originality. A woman's voice. A three-dimensional woman. Now there's this kind of rash of scripts that are coming out that are in answer, I think, for women to have better parts. But it seems as if what they do is, they write these parts for men and then they change the names and they make them women. And then we're talking about -- Well, this is a woman's role. But in fact, it's a man's role and it's got a woman's name on it. I'm seeing a lot of that. So it's an idea instead of being really interesting the way that women are, as human beings. We're all pretty interesting.

I think men are really interesting. I like all of Martin Scorsese's work, because you go see these men as full people who are compromised and not necessarily likable and they're flawed and challenging to watch... and compelling. So I want the same thing for women. And I think that's what Jane has done.

The great thing about "The Piano" is that it's a wonderful woman's part. And it's told from a woman's perspective, about love and femininity and sexuality and eroticism. But it's not a woman's movie. It's a movie that people can relate to, because they're people and the movie's about people. The men's roles in "The Piano" are also incredibly rich, fully blown. So that's what I kind of look for. It's not a feminist script, although I'm a feminist by nature. But only in that I want women to have the same opportunities as men. And I've got to say that the scripts don't offer me that.