By Paul Freeman [1993 Interview]

When listing the classic vocalists in rock’s history, Lou Gramm’s name should quickly come to mind.

The native of Rochester, New York, shot to prominence in the late 70s as lead singer of Foreigner. With Gramm’s intense vocals, entwined with British guitarist Mick Jones’ searing riffs, the band generated multi-platinum albums and such memorable hits as “Hot Blooded,” “Cold as Ice,” “Juke Box Hero” and “Waiting for a Girl Like You,” all co-written by Gramm and Jones.

Gramm left Foreigner after enjoying success as a solo artist with 1987’s “Ready or Not” and 1989’s “Long Hard Look.” He contributed the song “Lost in the Shadows” to the cult horror film “The Lost Boys.” But Gramm returned to the Foreigner fold in 1992.

Pop Culture Classics spoke to Gramm as Foreigner was touring again, following the release of the 1992 compilation, “The Very Best… And Beyond.”

Surgery to remove a brain tumor in 1997 temporarily affected Gramm’s performing career. But he has performed on and off with Foreigner over the years, including an appearance to mark the band’s 2017 40th anniversary celebrations. He and Jones were inducted into the Songwriters Hall of Fame in 2013. Gramm has penned an autobiography: “Juke Box Hero”: ”My Five Decades in Rock ‘N’ Roll.”

Now 67, reenergized and back in fine vocal form, Gramm continues to tour in 2018 with his own band, delivering his classic tunes to fans old and new.

POP CULTURE CLASSICS:
So the band got together originally in ’77?

LOU GRAMM:
’76 we started. I think the first album was early ’77.

PCC:
And how many members are involved in the current lineup?

GRAMM:
Actually, of the original members, it’s just Mick and myself. But we have some good people around us that we’re hoping to continue on with.

PCC:
Putting together the album, you added new songs?

GRAMM:
Yeah, there were three new songs.

PCC:
How did you find a balance, so the new ones would sound fresh, yet fit in with the classic material?

GRAMM:
Well, I don’t know. I think at that point, we were just seeing if we still had a good writing chemistry between Mick and myself. We weren’t going for anything in particular. Just we had give ourselves a time limit and if we wanted to put these songs along with this “Best of” album, then we had to get it in gear.

So we wrote about five or six songs and picked the best three. And they seemed to be pretty cohesive and stood up fairly well against some of the greatest hits stuff. So then it was a matter of — where do we put them? Do we intersperse them throughout the album? Do we put them at the end? And we decided we wanted to put them right at the top.

PCC:
How much gearing up did you have to do to get back into the co-writing mode? Or did it click instantaneously?

GRAMM:
Yeah, it kind of did. We weren’t quite sure what we were in for, because I actually hadn’t been in the band for a couple years, but as far as writing together, it maybe was a few more years on top of that. So in terms creativity, we hadn’t really done anything together in maybe four, four-and-a-half years. We were both a little bit anxious about it, but I think, after about half a day of knocking some ideas around, it felt very natural and we began to do the things that we used to do — which is make some pretty good music.

PCC:
Is there even more pressure, when you’re writing with the idea of including the songs with this collection of classic hits?

GRAMM:
[Laughs] You better believe it. There are some seriously strong songs there and we were worried that, even if we did begin to write, that the new stuff would really pale by comparison. I don’t know if the new ones really rate as classics, but just as pieces of music, they stand up pretty good.

PCC:
What caused the split in 1990? Why did you decide it was time to step away?

GRAMM:
Well, I think it was just kind of, since the late 80s, we really had not particularly gotten along well. We saw the direction the band was going. We couldn’t agree. Communication had broken down. It really had gotten to the point where a lot of people who were trying to be intermediaries between the two of us were actually keeping us from communicating.

So it got to be a mess. And I thought at one point, before there was lasting damage done to the relationship, then it would be best if I just left the band. I had outside interests that I wanted to pursue. And it seemed like everything I wanted to do was getting in the way of the band. So it became a matter of — do I want to belong as part of this band or not? And at that point, I did not.

PCC:
At that point, what was the direction you wanted to go in that conflicted?

GRAMM:
I really felt that the band should stay a little truer to its guitar-based rock/pop roots. And those are the things that I really loved about what we were doing. To hang a good vocal hook on a guitar riff was what it was all about. And anything else, in terms of keyboards, etc., were textures and embellishments. I felt that, direction-wise, we had gotten away from what we did the best and had begun to pursue a path that kind of softened the band’s musical image. And I just was not relating to that. I honestly did not want to be part of it.

PCC:
So that softening, was that a result of veering towards the sound that would be the safest commercially?

GRAMM:
Well, not consciously, no. I think basically, a lot of it derived out of the success of “I Want to Know What Love Is,” which certainly I wouldn’t consider commercially safe. I think it’s pretty much of a one of a kind song, where you have rock, R&B, blended with kind of like gospel overtones. I think it was the first of its kind. However, that brought a lot of unnecessary and unwanted attention to Foreigner, the ballad band [laughs].

The rock songs seemed to be getting much less attention and the softer, more Adult Contemporary songs were getting the bulk of the attention. It really kind of changed the public’s perception of Foreigner. They forgot about “Urgent” and “Hot Blooded” and “Jukebox Hero” and all they wanted to hear was those beautiful ballads. And for me, that was like, “Oh, God! Get me outta here!”

PCC:
Once you got out of there, what went on for that couple of years?

GRAMM:
Well, I was really busy. I had a lot of songs that couldn’t find their way onto Foreigner albums, good songs. And I actually had already begun a kind of parallel solo career, which I really enjoyed doing, because it gave me the freedom I think I needed. Mick and I are really prolific writers. If you have 20 or 25 good ideas, 10 will find their way to the record. So there a lot of things I could do with songs.

And I really enjoyed doing them. It gave me the experience I needed in the production area. I actually felt it was really worthwhile to do that. Mick, on the other hand decided he wanted to continue on with the band, got a new singer and made another album. He also made a solo album and did some production work with Billy Joel and a few other people. So we were both very busy.

PCC:
And then what changed, so you decided it would be a good idea to get together again?

GRAMM:
Well, it was earlier in the year, ’92 that is, that Atlantic Records released a “Best Of” in Europe. It went through the roof. It got a lot of attention. And I think there were a lot of hints dropped, to the both of us, that it certainly wasn’t too late — or a bad idea — for the two of us to begin talking again… without anybody to “interpret” for us, that we did have a good friendship and a good creative relationship at one point and there was no reason why we couldn’t do it again.

We weren’t like mortal enemies. Over those couple years, we did talk periodically, just to see what each other was up to and wish each other well. We just didn’t want to work together. So we did initiate a few calls, met in Los Angeles during the riots, in ’92…

PCC:
Didn’t take that as an omen, I guess.

GRAMM:
No, if anything, it was a good omen [chuckles]. It was kind of like we were sequestered under martial law in a hotel. So we weren’t going anyplace. It looked like we were going to have to talk this thing through or else. So it ended up being a really good situation and the next move for us was to test our writing chemistry again.

And that kind of brings us up to date. We did this. We want to let everybody know it’s not just three songs and a “Best Of.” This is going to be ongoing. We’re going to pick up the ball and run with it. I think that we can still be relevant and make very relevant music. And that’s our intention.

PCC:
What have you learned about one another that will help you deal with each other better this time?

GRAMM:
Well, I just think — and I think Mick would agree — that should there be problems or disagreements, it’s better for us to face them right away. We don’t need anybody else around to smooth out rough edges or sweep the road clean for us. We’ll do it together. We’ll either agree or disagree to each other’s faces. At the end of the day, we have to feel that whatever we contribute to the songs or the direction of the band, we have to feel good about it. It can’t just be one person. Basically, if we’re going to do this, we have to do this as a team. That’s the bottom line.

PCC:
What about that previous conflict about the softening of the music?

GRAMM:
I believe that that will — and we’ve talked about it, too — I think that was just a phase that maybe Mick was going through. And I think that, if there’s a little more creative equity between us, since my leanings are a little towards harder rock, the band will remain very diverse, as it always has been. And not be slanted one way or another. It’ll cover all areas.

PCC:
What are your musical roots? What were the early influences?

GRAMM:
Well, I started playing drums at eight years old. I didn’t really begin singing as a front man until I was about 20. But I did a lot of listening. And I loved singing. But I just never thought I was good enough. I think The Beatles, particularly the songs that Lennon sang, influenced me a lot. Motown, for sure. Marvin Gaye. Those were the first.

And then probably the second British wave — Humble Pie, Steve Marriott; Paul Rodgers in Free; Steve Winwood. Had definite influences from Bill Champlin. Sons of Champlin, Bill Champlin was a mentor of mine, a vocal mentor. He’s a great vocalist. So varied influences.

PCC:
The British/New York mix in Foreigner, does that add some special energy?

GRAMM:
Don’t know. There’s certain something about British guitar players, for sure, certainly from the school that Mick’s from. He’s much more of a stylist than a crash-and-burn type of soloist. I think he has a real roots feel for R&B-based guitar playing. He’s a riff guitar player, which is my favorite kind of player.

And then on my side, while I was influenced mostly by British vocalists, I think that, with the Motown influences I had, it lends somewhat of a no-frills kind of singing to my style. And I think the combination of the two of us has made it, and continues to make it, pretty interesting music.

PCC:
Now, as far as doing the classic Foreigner material on tour, is it difficult for you to keep it fresh? Or do you change the interpretations subtly?

GRAMM:
Well, I’ll tell you what, Paul, the new guys we’ve got around us haven’t kind of been dulled by playing these songs over the course of 15 years. So they really do inject a new life’s blood into the music. And we have changed the arrangements slightly. But we still stay true to the meat-and-potatoes of the songs. Mick and I haven’t really toured together extensively since ’85. So these songs are sounding fresh again. And we’re loving it.

PCC:
’85 — that was an arena tour?

GRAMM:
That was the “Agent Provocateur” tour, the last North American tour we had done.

PCC:
So that was an arena tour. You’re playing somewhat smaller venues this time around?

GRAMM:
It’s like theatre and large, concert-type clubs. We’re actually having a good time, because we weren’t afforded that type of beginning. We went right from our inception to playing arenas, opening for people. But then within four months, we were headlining the same venues. So it’s always been 10,000-plus for us. So we’re not viewing this as the big comedown. We’re actually enjoying the intimacy of some of these great old theatres and in-your-face kind of rock/blues clubs. It’s something we didn’t get to experience the first time around, so we’re making the most of it.

PCC:
So is there just a sense of continuation? Or is there some sense of starting over?

GRAMM:
There’s probably a little bit of both. In terms of the audience, I think the cross-section, the age demographics, are really mixed. We see some very young kids… who seem to know all the words and are really into it. And of course, the people who grew up with us. So it’s real interesting. And I think that, on one hand, we have to prove ourselves a little bit again, on the other hand, there’s still a very strong core following for the band.

PCC:
Is it a challenge to try to please the old fans while appealing to new audiences, as well?

GRAMM:
It hasn’t been. Maybe it should be, but it hasn’t been. I think the band is sounding better now than it ever has. And I think most of these songs really do stand up to time well. There’s very few pf them that we’re playing and saying to ourselves, “Boy, this sounds dated.” It just doesn’t feel that way. It still sounds pretty fresh.

PCC:
Do you hear a lot of stuff on the charts now that sounds very much like Foreigner?

GRAMM:
I mean, I wouldn’t name names, but I think over 15 years of doing what we’ve done, and fortunately with the success we’ve had, people tend to emulate a little bit the ones who’ve left their influence. And I think that we’ve made enough of a mark to hear new bands that sound a little bit similar to us, just in small ways. And we’re flattered by that.

And I think, for the type of music we do, we’ve never really followed trends. We’ve kind of stayed true to what we do. I think there’s still room for us, for our kind of music, however you want to categorize it — I don’t care to. I think in radio, and for the kids on the street, they still want to hear it.

PCC:
The goals — have they changed much? Are you competing with your past now?

GRAMM:
No, I don’t think so. I would like to think that, creatively, we haven’t run dry. The well hasn’t run dry — that’s for sure. I always felt we were a little bit too inactive in the 80s. We could have come out with more albums than we did. It was a little bit of an album or two and then a couple years off. I like to stay real busy. So I don’t feel like we’re tapped out.

And I think the competition in general is much heavier than it was. There’s a tremendous inundation of groups and artists of all formats. And I don’t think we necessarily need to achieve mega-stardom, packing 20,000-seat arenas. If that’s to be for us, fine. If that’s not in the cards, I would be very satisfied with just radio airplay, people knowing that we’re still around and we still make great music and to play a modest-sized venue and have people come out and really dig it. I don’t consider that sitting back on my haunches. There’s a sense of realism about what we’re doing. And it may not be for everybody.

For the latest news and tour dates, visit www.lou-gramm.com