By Paul Freeman (1988 interview)

“Tony Bennett Sings The Ultimate American Songbook” is his latest album. And Tony Bennett may very well be the ultimate American singer.

Bennett first reached the top of the charts with “Because of You” in 1951. In 1962, he released one of his signature tunes, “I Left My Heart in San Francisco.”

Frank Sinatra said of Bennett, “"For my money, Tony Bennett is the best singer in the business. He excites me when I watch him. He moves me. He's the singer who gets across what the composer has in mind, and probably a little more."

Since the ‘80s, Bennett’s smooth vocal style has been attracting younger generations of listeners. In 2001, he was honored with the Grammy Lifetime Achievement Award.

Bennett’s artistry is as impressive on canvas as it is on vinyl. He paints using his real name, Benedetto.

He recently donated a painting to the Smithsonian’s National Portrait Gallery. Titled “God Is Love,” it’s a watercolor depiction of long-time friend and fellow jazz legend Duke Ellington. This is Bennett’s third painting accepted by the museum.

With wife/educator Susan Benedetto, he founded the non-profit Exploring The Arts, promotes arts education in public schools (www.exploringthearts.org).

POP CULTURE CLASSICS:
Do you get a different sort of satisfaction from painting than you do from singing?

TONY BENNETT:
Well, yeah, because one, you have to really be on your toes in front of an audience, especially in supper clubs, where there’s all kinds of other activities going on [Chuckles]. You have to really stay wide awake.

With painting, it’s a meditative kind of situation, where you put some nice music on and you get very much into concentration, with very few distractions.

PCC:
Were you initially hesitant to exhibit your paintings, because it is such as personal art form?

BENNETT:
I wasn’t hesitant... I was so nervous, I was a basket case [Laughs]. The first one was in the early ‘70s, at a gallery in Chicago, I told the cab driver to turn around and go back to the hotel. I didn’t know what to expect. A friend of mine said, ‘Have an exhibition’ and I took him up on it, very reluctantly. And then, as I got closer to it, I really got panicked. But I found out, once I got in the gallery, that I was very well received. And it’s been that way ever since.

The more I did these showings, the better I felt about them. Johnny Carson had a lot to do with it. I was surprised when he said, ‘Bring your paintings on the show.’ I said,’You’re kidding.’ He said, ‘No, I like your paintings. Bring them on here.’ And then he promoted them and the people applauded the paintings, as he showed them. And before I knew it, all these distinguished galleries around the country started calling me up, saying, ‘We’d love to have your paintings in our gallery.’ Ever since then, we’ve done numerous exhibitions, in many cities.

PCC:
Had Johnny seen your paintings at your home?

BENNETT:
I was his very first guest. He saw my paintings at my home and liked them a lot. And then when it came time for me to guest again on his show, he said, ‘Bring your paintings on the show.’ He really opened up a whole new world for me and I’m grateful to him for doing that, because it’s just a whole new adventure.

It’s something that was my hobby. A friend of mine said, ‘Stretch out. You paint every day. Make it your occupation.’ And sure enough, I got well into it.

PCC:
Had you always previously viewed it as a hobby? You had attended Manhattan’s High School of the Industrial Arts. At that point were you considering art as a career?

BENNETT:
Well, I got very lucky with my singing first. But I always had a love for painting, so I just kept it up. As I travel, I put together sketches and paintings of wherever I’ve been.

PCC:
What are the similarities between art and music?

BENNETT:
I’m starting to realize, after doing the two, that all arts have the same rudiments. It’s what to leave out. It’s economy of line, of course. And form, color, balance, nuance. All these words pertain, whether it’s writing or cooking or landscaping or painting or singing or any of the crafts. All of the same rules pertain to each one of the arts.

PCC:
So has painting had a positive effect on your creativity as a vocalist?

BENNETT:
Absolutely. When I’m on stage, because there’s all these various lights on stage, reflections, illusions - the lights play great tricks on your eyes. They’re so bright. The audience doesn’t see that. But it becomes very strong on stage. The audience looks dark. And in that darkness, it’s almost like a palette. You experience all these imaginary, illusionary images. I remember Duke Ellington kept saying, whenever he looked in the spotlights, he always saw butterflies. With these images, it’s almost like looking at clouds in the sky. You see shapes that become recognizable. So when you’re singing, you think of painting. And when you paint, you think of singing.

PCC:
Have you ever tried to recreate, on canvas, those images that you’ve seen in the lights?

BENNETT:
You know, it’s interesting that you say that, because I just came back from Holland and there’s a wonderful artist there by the name of Toon Hermans. He’s a famous performer, as big as Bob Hope or Johnny Carson over there. He does pantomime. People in Holland absolutely adore him. And he took me to his home, which was 10 minutes from the TV studio, because he heard I painted. And we became immediate friends. I walked into his home. I couldn’t believe his magnificent paintings. He’s very famous as a painter in Holland, even though he’s also famous as an entertainer. And he has his paintings all over the walls.

He does everything from imagination. He’ll look at landscape or a still life or a person and he absorbs it, very, very strongly, memorizes it. And then he has total recall about a piece and knows exactly what he’s going to do with it. Then, when he’s inspired, he goes over to his canvas and, in 25 minutes, he reproduces what he remembers. And you should see how magnificent his paintings are, completed from memory. Very different from anything I’ve seen.

PCC:
Do you primarily stick with realistic interpretations of what you see, rather than abstract?

BENNETT:
The only criticism I’ve had is that they say, ‘You haven’t got a style.’ I say to myself, ‘Good.’ Because I just paint. I don’t really try and paint the same thing over and over again, which, for me, would be almost like going to purgatory. I keep studying art. I keep thinking of it. And whatever I’m interested in at the time, that’s what I start doing, whether it’s Egyptian or Greek or Italian or French or Chinese. Wherever the study of the history of art takes me, that’s what I paint. So I don’t really have one style. I paint all different ways.

PCC:
Are there any particular artists who especially influenced or inspired you over the years?

BENNETT:
Oh, yeah, there’s so many. Impressionists like Monet or post-impressionists like Matisse, Picasso. But I really like Michelangelo as far as great, great painting. And my favorite contemporary painter is David Hockney.

PCC:
You still sing scales, 20 minutes, three times a day?

BENNETT:
Yes.

PCC:
Do also make a regimen of painting every day?

BENNETT:
Yes, I paint every day, also. I block off time. I’m very fortunate. I’ve migrated to the three things I love to do the best. For exercise, I play tennis. And then I do my scales and study music and then I paint. Those are the three things I’m disciplined in and keep studying, trying to learn as much as I can.

PCC:
You have portable art equipment for the road?

BENNETT:
Yes, gloss and watercolor and pen-and-ink, all equipment that’s very easy to handle. I can put my hands under the water and clean my hands real quick. With oils, it’s kind of messy, so I’d need more time for that.

PCC:
How long does it usually take you to complete, say, a watercolor?

BENNETT:
It varies. The watercolors tend to go pretty fast, because you do a lot of thinking about it, before you do it. But with the oil paints, sometimes it’ll be quick and other times it will take a long time. Months. Now with this fellow Toon that I mentioned, he does all of his paintings in 25 minutes. Incredible. They’re lovely. Unlike the Dutch tradition, which has very dark colors, he’s full of life and beauty and brightness, a lot of colors, simplicity. Very pleasant to look at.

PCC:
If you spend months on a work of art, is it difficult to part with it?

BENNETT:
Oh, yes. Quite a few paintings. There’s a self-portrait that I did years ago that I really like. And there’s a Duke Ellington painting that I did that I did in London many years ago. And there was one painting that I worked a year-and-a-half on, of the Royal Albert Hall, when I did the 100th anniversary of Royal Albert Hall with Robert Farnon and the London Philharmonic. In that painting, I painted every person in the hall. So there’s about three or four paintings I couldn’t even think of getting rid of and selling them to somebody. I’m doing one of my son right now. I’ve done quite a few of my daughters. So they’re personal and private. I give those kinds of paintings to my loved ones.

PCC:
Before your paintings were greeted with such acclaim, were you concerned that the public might perceive this as just another celebrity indulging a whim?

BENNETT:
I’m a very fortunate entertainer and performer. My peers have always been very strong in endorsing me. In the music world, I had Bing Crosby and Sinatra and Judy Garland, shockingly, I’ll never get over it, saying, for one reason or another, that I was their favorite entertainer and the best they’d ever heard. And then in the painting field, the late Andy Warhol and that fellow I mentioned, David Hockney, who’s the apparent heir to Picasso, and Elaine de Kooning, people like that. They’ve endorsed me as a very strong painter. They said, ‘Just keep painting, because you know how to paint.’

I figure if my peers, who are the top of the line, give me this great encouragement - Cary Grant brought my painting to the south of France - these great, distinguished people, moved by my work. This inspired me and made me realize that I just had to roll up my sleeves and just be consistent and just keep painting and keep singing.

PCC:
Why did you decide to sign all your paintings “Benedetto,’ rather than ‘Bennett.’?

BENNETT:
First of all, I used to get a lot of criticism from a lot of Italian-Americans, who used to say, ‘What did you change your name for?’ Like I was embarrassed over it, which I wasn’t. Years ago, Bob Hope changed my name to Tony Bennett. He said Anthony Dominick Benedetto is too long for the marquee. He said, ‘Let’s Americanize it and call you Tony Bennett.’ I was just superstitious enough to keep it, because that was my big break in show business.

But then, I came back to my family name, also to separate, to show that there are two occupations here. One is an entertainer. One is a painter.

PCC:
A lot of people say that everybody can sing or everybody can paint. Is it mainly a matter of application and dedication? Or does there have to be a natural gift?

BENNETT:
I don’t think that everybody can do it. Everybody can, but there’s one missing element It’s the people who have this missing element who are the ones that succeed and that is the gift of determination, of wanting to do it, of having a passion to do it. A lot of people know how to do it. There are so many people who are very, very intelligent and scholarly. But they don’t have the passion. You see, it’s not that I want to paint. I have an ambition. I have to paint. It’s the same way with my singing.

On my 60th birthday, I felt very strange. I said, ‘God, I’ve been singing and painting my whole life. Why am I doing this? How come I didn’t become someone who put girders together on skyscrapers or a baker or something? Why this single-mindedness that makes me have to paint and have to sing? I’ve been doing these things since I was a little boy.’

PCC:
So is that a result of the way you were raised or something you inherited?

BENNETT:
It’s part the environment and it’s part what you’re born with. I just sense that it is. I’m not a scientist. I’m not an expert psychologist. But I really just know that I have to do it. It’s not that I want to do it. I have to do it. I just don’t know any other way.

PCC:
Is it more difficult to keep the music fresh for yourself than it would be with art?

BENNETT:
Oh, no, both music and art are never-ending adventures. You never finishing learning. You hit certain plateaus. You get lucky with certain paintings or with certain performances that you do. Then you’re hit with how much you still have to learn all the time. The more you learn, the less you know. It’s the whole adventure that becomes the success of it all, not any particular moment, but just doing it, just being able to do it... and taking the journey of searching for as much knowledge as you can muster up and trying to contribute as much as you can.

PCC:
It’s hard to imagine Tony Bennett still having anything to learn in music.

BENNETT:
No, there’s a lot. You’d be surprised. There’s a lot.

PCC:
In what areas are there still things left for you to discover?

BENNETT:
Well, you know, all you have to do is listen to one of the old masters like Bach or some of the great modern masters, like Shostakovich or Stravinsky and you say, ‘Oh, my God, there’s a lot to learn.’ [Chuckles]. I’m a popular singer and compared to the works of Stravinsky, it really humbles you right away.

PCC:
Do you find that the public’s taste in art isn’t as fickle as it might be in music?

BENNETT:
Oh, I think it’s even more so. Tragically, it’s become very fashionable in the last 30 years. In one sense, it’s great. What Warhol contributed, he kind of took the snobbishness out of it all and just allowing all kinds of art to happen. The Metropolitan Museum is very responsible for that, too. They loosened up the rules as to what makes great painting. Now almost everything works - the old-fashioned, the new. It’s really a great era right now.

PCC:
As far as your listening tastes, do you appreciate newer artists, as well as the classic pop singers?

BENNETT:
You have newer artists like Wynton Marsalis and Hubert Laws, who are really saying something. And I can’t discount the old masters, like Dizzy Gillespie, people like that, too. And, of course, I love Billy Joel and Stevie Wonder, the obvious stuff that you hear, that’s very, very clever, very well done. But it’s still not as prolific as the songwriters of the ‘30s and ‘40s, the age of miracles, when you had Cole Porter, Irving Berlin and Gershwin. Magnificent. I always call it the best folk music that any nation has in the world.

PCC:
When younger artists record material from the Great American Songbook, does that give you hope that new generations will come to appreciate the music?

BENNETT:
I just read an article that was very complimentary to Sinatra and Sarah Vaughan and myself, as spearheading it and the fact that it’s back in vogue with the young people now and that they’ve caught on to this music. There are a lot of young people now collecting classics of American music. It’s broadening out. The Beatles generation now have children and are very married and very settled down and they’re just saying, ‘Let’s see what else is around. The Beatles are vintage now. Let’s find out what other vintage music we might appreciate.’

So they’re going to discover Fats Waller. They’re going to discover the early Sinatra. They’re going to discover Billie Holiday and Stan Kenton and great bands like Jimmie Lunceford and Count Basie and Woody Herman. These records are going to last forever, because they’re great performances. Louis Jordan sounds great today. There’s a whole potpourri of this great entertainment that really is strictly American. It’s not British at all. It’s strictly American music. And it’s dynamite.

I travel around the world. I go to every country in the world and perform. And they know all these great songs like ‘Night and Day’ or ‘Dancing in the Dark,’ ‘Easy to Love’ - they just love these songs. It’s such a thrill to play in Japan, for a Japanese audience, and they all start applauding these songs. They know them so well.

PCC:
You’re certainly attracting many new young fans wherever you go.

BENNETT:
We play venues like the Radio City Music Hall and the Hollywood Bowl and as far as your eye can see, there are people. And I’ve had my producer come running backstage and say, ‘God, there are more young people in the audience than the older people.’ They’re just happy to see a good performance now. They’re walking away from demographics. Madison Avenue may still think that way, advertising their product. But the public just seems to say, ‘Hey, let’s just go see a good show.’

I saw the wonderful Cab Calloway at the Red Parrot one night and there was a whole bunch of young people, Beatle fan age. And he was really tearing them apart, just like he was one of The Beatles. They just want to see a good show. They don’t care where it comes from or how old someone is or how young someone is. If they can walk out, saying, ‘God, we enjoyed ourselves tonight. That guy made us feel good,’ that’s plenty for them.

PCC:
Do you ever get tired of singing ‘I Left My Heart In San Francisco’?

BENNETT:
That’s like asking, ‘Do you ever get tired of making love?’ [He laughs.] You see, it’s just like saying to a painter, ‘Well, you can’t be good, because you sell paintings. If you sell paintings, you’re not that good, because all good painters starved.’ We run into these clichés.

That’s been my meal ticket. That’s my calling card. All over the world, people say, ‘Please sing ‘San Francisco.’’ It’s as fresh as the first day I recorded it, because it’s about the greatest city in the world and it’s right in the United States. I am a U.S. citizen. So it just feels so great to sing it in far-off lands. That song has made me a world citizen. I just can’t frown on it. I happen to love the song. I love singing it and I like the way people react to it. Ever since I recorded that song, I’ve been sold out all over the world. And that’s a lot of years. So I’m very grateful.

Find out about Tony Bennett’s upcoming concert dates at:
wwwtonybennett.net

And to view his artwork, visit:
www.benedettoarts.com